Okay, what would you think? What's the most important thing to keep in mind when you meet meditation teachers? Ask a question. That is the most important thing to do with teachers. There's a Sutta that records the Buddha as stating, "It is through conversation that a person's wisdom is understood." How are you going to test your teachers when you go and meet a brand new teacher? I talk a lot about it in the Day 9 evening talk in the normal retreat about what to do when you go visit teachers, but I never actually talk about testing the teachers.
How are you going to test your teacher? How do you figure out that they're actually wise? When you think about it, do you know they're wise because they're giving a Dhamma talk, giving a talk up on a platform like here? You've watched me and Rosemary give talks, and what we say in the talks is from our own knowledge. But you know somebody else could give our talks even better than we can. Someone else could be more lively or convey more emotion or this or that. They could memorize them. I'm sure a great actor/actress could do a better job. It doesn't mean that they have the Wisdom, though. Giving a Dhamma talk doesn't mean it, either.
If you read a book from a teacher and think, "Oh, nice stuff, nice stuff," that still doesn't mean the teacher actually knew, what they wrote, in their heart, in their mind. It means that they can write it, but, well, anyone can take our books and then rewrite a new book all based on what we've written. It doesn't mean that they know anything. So giving a talk or writing a book is not the best way to judge a teacher.
Talking with the teacher is the best way because you can go back and forth. Right now, you're not actually talking with us with these questions, but you're watching us answer them without ever having looked at them before. In interviews, there is a back-and-forth communication going back and forth, back and forth. You're testing us all the time, aren't you? Especially in your first interview. Can you remember back to your very first interview? You saw us on stage, you saw us walking around, and then you came for your first interview. When you walked in, some of you were probably afraid, wondering, "What are Steve and Rosemary like? Who are they anyhow?" Even with some of our assistants who've been with us for years, the first interview wasn't longer than two minutes. In, out.
So when you meet a teacher, test them. That's most important. Test them. See if this is really somebody you can trust. See if this is somebody you want to learn from. When I talk in the retreat about going up a mountain, how you don't visit a violin teacher if you want to play the piano, or visit a tennis teacher if you want to learn to swim. Some teachers can be great, but they don't have the answers that are fit for you because their practice is motivated in a different way. Maybe some teacher is really big on Determination, really big on Energy. With Determination and Energy, you know what they like to do: sit still for four hours, be tough. Now what would happen to all of you if Rosemary and I were that type of teacher? Would you have stayed? Ha. The odds are no, and the odds are we wouldn't have many retreats after a while because nobody would ever want to have to come to such tough Western teachers. But when you talk to your teacher, if you match - if you match in what they're teaching and what you want to listen to - and you really feel they have it, and you ask them more and you ask them more and they come back with good answers, then you can develop a trust in the teacher.
Trust is very important. When you trust a teacher, what happens to your next interview? Before you even come to the interview, what happens if you trust the teacher? What happens to most, if not all, of you when you come to your interviews with us? Do you expect good information? Do you expect that we're going to give you something that will work? Generally, yes, because you have trust in us. Then you're more open. You're more open to listen when you have this trust in a teacher and you respect the teacher. You're going to listen to the teacher better. You're going to remember what the teacher said because it's important. You may go write it down right after an interview; you're going to try to remember it.
Now, remembering it is not good enough yet, though, right? You have to then practice it. When you practice it, you make it your own wisdom; you make it your own understanding. That's what we want you to do. But without that trust in a teacher, without that respect, you're not going to want to listen to the teacher; you won't really care. You'll just go back and do whatever you want to do. So developing that trust and respect in the teacher depends on testing the teacher and seeing whether this teacher is really somebody you do want to trust and respect. So what is important to keep in mind when meeting meditation teachers? Test them. See if they're really the teacher who will be good for you.